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Discussion Starter #1
I purchased an FSR LS1 conversion radiator for my 96 SS build but I ran into a problem when I went to install the fans. I took the fans off my old radiator and my first issue was that the clips of the top and bottom did not fit over the flange of the new radiator as the flange was too wide. Next, when trying to mount the fans, I saw that the holes in the fan mounting legs were larger than the posts welded to the radiator so they end up sitting over the posts instead of on top of the post. This caused the fans to drop too low and one ended up touching the tank.

I called up FSR and they told me that they built their radiators to replace the "HD" 1 3/8ths radiator and that I must have had the 1" standard radiator. That would make sense as to why the mounting clips wouldn't sit over the flange. I didn't even know there was an "HD" radiator option for the SS though. Do the cooling fans mount differently on that radiator?

I could make this work, but I'm thinking if I could just find the "HD" fans and mounting clips then supposedly they should bolt right up.

FSR offered to take the radiator back and modify it to work with my fans, i'd just rather skip the hassle of shipping it.
 

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I could make this work, but I'm thinking if I could just find the "HD" fans and mounting clips then supposedly they should bolt right up.

I guess we still are learning about these cars. I was going to say BS about the clip differences. But for some reason there are different radiator clips for 96 vs 94/95,


I will call BS on the fan motor frame mounts. There is only one right fan mount listed for 94/95/96. For the left there are four. The listings are all for 94 to 96 but that does not make sense. One goes with the clutch fan, one would be for the 94 only large electric motor, what differences are between the last two are in the order codes. They all use the year appropriate mount clips.


The radiators seem to all be the same. The core is listed as NS so there is no way to verify width, BUT if there were different widths there would have to be two different clips for each year. The end tanks are different depending on transmission and oil cooler packages.


Check a online supplier to figure out if there was a width difference between 94/95 and 96 rads. The afermarket stock rads would have to match the clips or there would be many complaints.
 

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There's a rather entailing thread (or two) on the various fan combos, some info may spill over pertaining to the radiator. I've had to attend to fans on both my cars, and can only mention a couple things crossing over to what you need. Aftermarket larts listings are misleading and in a few cases downright wrong. Both my cars do NOT have the 'HD cooling', which I believe is reserved for just tow package FWs and RMs (V4P). Both cars DO however have heavier duty fan setups than some reported base Caprices in that the PS fan is primary and smaller (100amp?) and the DS is secondary and larger (130amp?). Not interchangeable side-to-side as the motor housings are not reverable mirror image and measurably different fan diameters that are not practical to mod the center fan attachments. Putting a bigger DS fan in the PS is not feasible either for the same reason. There are some guys swear they have the smaller fans stock on both sides (L99?, Caprices without tranny coolers ? IDK)

A guy might think if no mech. fans then no 'HD cooling' and/or no thick radiator (even if there is one). Maybe look up rad apps for a FW and SS and see how similar, and then look up a Cady/Buick V4P to see a difference. I can tell you some part house listings refer to the 130amp fan as 'HD' but improper GM terminology.



HTH, likely not.
 

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Re 96 Black: I think he means Watts when he wrote Amps. Fans were 100,150, and 240 Watts.


BALLSS Thanks for the pictures. Thumnails may be smaller but they are on the forum and may outlast 3rd party picture hosts.


BALLSS and 96Black, you both say your 96 is stock but you show the V03 cooling fans(one 240W). Would you both check what cooling system your SPI sticker shows? The rumor is the 240W was 94 only.



There's a rather entailing thread (or two) on the various fan combos
I have a quote(Scott?) that was posted somewhere.
Their were 3 fan motors used in the 94-96 cars. 100 watt,150 watt and 240 watt. The 100 and 150 used the same mount,the 150 was just a little deeper.100 and 150= completely interchangeable and put on MANY cars. The 240 watt is a different story. It uses a different mount and its only available for the driver side. The 240 watt cools VERY well, however continued use WILL melt the weak stock relays and any sockets their put in! The startup current is just to much. It was mostly used as the secondary to the mechanical on towing versions. It does have a few other applications as well! The fan itself is interchangeable with all 3. The V92 tow pack always includes V08 cooling, which always includes the mech fan [which incurs a 10 peak horse penalty].

Does it also include an extra trans cooler?Technically, no. All 94-96 B-cars have an integral transmission cooler close-coupled to the radiator.

All LT1 B- & D- cars also have an additional external transmission oil cooler.Does RPO V08 also include a heavy duty radiator as well?Couldn't tell you. These days, the only radiator variants I can find are:

civilian radiator with integral motor oil & transmission oil coolers
9C1 radiator with integral transmission oil cooler only, no oil cooler
(On this, I could be misinformed.)Is there a difference between base cooling and extra-capacity cooling?The base cooling option was a 150W primary fan, and a 100W 2ndary fan.
The V03 cooling option upgraded the 2ndary fan to 240W.

The V08 cooling option that came with the V92 tow pack upgraded the primary fan from a 150W elec fan to a 7,457W mechanical fan, and kept the 240W 2ndary.There are two optional cooling system upgrades for LT1 B/D-cars, called V03 (Extra Capacity Cooling), and V08 (Heavy Duty Cooling). Performance models such as the WX3 (Impala SS) and 9C1 (Police) cars automatically get the upgraded V03 (Extra Capacity Cooling) system. V03 includes a larger radiator, an increased capacity A/C condenser, and an upgraded secondary electric fan. V03 is also optional on most B/D-car models.

Note that the '94 V03 (Extra Capacity Cooling) option uses a 150-watt primary (RH) fan, and an upgraded 240-watt secondary (LH) fan. In '95-'96 the V03 package was revised and no longer included an upgraded 240-watt secondary fan. Instead the standard 100-watt secondary fan was used, which is the same as the base cooling system.
PM538 for the driver side and PM540 passenger side on SS cooling package. The driver's side fan on my car has part number 22137068 and the PM9040 is the direct replacement.( '95 Caprice wagon)
The primary fan is the one on the passenger side. It comes on when the A/C is on or if the A/C is off and the temp gets to 228 degrees. The other one is the secondary fan and it comes on when the temp gets to 232 degrees.
ACDELCO Part # 158498 {#22137318} MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN RIGHT HAND; w/o HVY DUTY CLG(V08)

ACDELCO Part # 158490 {#22136414} MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN LEFT HAND; w/o EXTRA CAPACITY CLG(V03) or HVY DUTY CLG(V08)

ACDELCO Part # 158429 {#88890735} MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN LEFT HAND; w/ENG OIL CLG(KC4) or EXTRA CAPACITY CLG(V03) or HVY DUTY CLG(V08); IDENT ASM# 22137220

The CORRECT GM # is 88890735 List $140.00 Shop $ 100.80
Same part ACDelco 15-8429 GM PART # 22137318
PACK QTY: 1
List Price: $132.28
Price: $68.12
DESCRIPTION: MOTOR KIT (RH - passenger side) - this is PRIMARY fan (150w motor)

GM PART # 88890735
PACK QTY: 1
List Price: $144.00
Price: $74.16
DESCRIPTION: MOTOR KIT (LH - driver side) - this is SECONDARY fan (100w motor)

ACDelco Tech Connect info
15-8429 MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN Left Hand
With RPO ENG OIL CLG(KC4) ^ EXTRA CAPACITY CLG(V03) ^ HVY DUTY CLG(V08) IDENT ASM# 22137220

15-8429 MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN Left Hand
With RPO EXTRA CAPACITY CLG(V03) ^ SEO AUX ENG OIL CLR(7P8) ^ SEO TAXI CAB(9C6) IDENT ASM# 22137220

15-8490 MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN Left Hand
With RPO EXTRA CAPACITY CLG(V03) ^ SEO AUX ENG OIL CLR(7P8) Without RPO SEO TAXI CAB(9C6)
15-8490 MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN Left Hand
Without RPO EXTRA CAPACITY CLG(V03) ^ HVY DUTY CLG(V08)

15-8498 MOTOR KIT,ENG CLG FAN Right Hand
Without RPO HVY DUTY CLG(V08)
Rock Auto
Motor info (alt PN's - 22134671, 22136414, 22136897, 22137318, 22137319)
More motor info (alt PN's - 22105177, 22134671, 22136414, 22136897, 22137318, 22137319, 88892898, GM3116101)

I think some may have to redefine Extra Capacity Cooling System. I think it refers to higher air flow and not extra coolant as it did in older cars.
 

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Boy I'm glad you found that post. It turns out the one I referred to. It de-mistakes my misspokes above. And yes it's watts. Both my cars have SPID V03. They both have the 240/150 setup, as the fan motors are nowhere near close enough in size to be interchangeable as Scott? reports the 150/100 are.
 

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In 94 & 95, V03 cooling fans were 150W primary and 240W 2ndary.

In 96 the 2ndary fan was demoted from 240W to 100W. (In 96, quite possibly to avoid relocating the fan relays outside the relay box, the only cars to get a 240W 2ndary fan, had a 7,457W primary fan.)
 

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Marky-, looks like overpost. But, would seem to contradict both my cars' builds???? Maybe your reply relates to only base Caprice/RM. IDK if both FW and FWB got V03, but my FWB does.
 

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Just paraphrasing what Scot Mueller said years ago; in 96, GM only paired 240W 2ndary fans with 7,457W primary fans (aka V92 & V4P, both of which require V08).
All other non tow pack B- & D- cars [in 96] got 150W primaries & 100W 2ndaries.

Check Z09B4U's quote: "In '95-'96 the V03 package was revised …"
(No insult to you or your cars' builds intended.)
 

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Both my cars have SPID V03. They both have the 240/150 setup, as the fan motors are nowhere near close enough in size
96Black My personal confusion on the 95/96 fan size is that the few I have seen had the cylinder(small motor) fan mounts left and right as per Scott(?). That is why I am looking for 95/96 one owner cars that are sure they have the 240W(flat motor) fans.


I do not want to perpetuate a rumor but I was sure people had swapped 150W motors for the 100W motors. Electrical connections would have to be changed but the cylinder style (small motor) case should fit both left and right small motor mounts?
 

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.... Both my cars have SPID V03. They both have the 240/150 setup....
OK. Let me just volunteer on top of what I reported that the black '96 was purchased new, and the white '96 was purchased 2 years ago with 5X,XXX with zero indications of anything ever having been altered under the hood much less the rest of the car from oem other than tint, its heinous Vogue wheels and tires (since replaced w/ CTS and nice Conti's) plus a removed MIL bulb when purchased - which I wasn't aware of - and kick myself for falling for - (the broken tab on the dash lower panel shooda' been a tip-off but I ASSumed it was from some kid-installed alarm) - that I only found out about when trying to get it inspected - that masked a P0336 code from an earlier crapola opti replacement (since replaced with re-rebuilt oem ACD). And an alarm (since surgically excised). I vaguely recall some of this same discrepancy and competing info about fans/years previously when doing the DS motor on the Cady last year. In that case the parts listing descriptions were so bad that I ended up with the tiny motor and had to return/replace to get the correct big one.

Unclear on your description of 'flat motor', except that the DS on both cars is the comparatively 'big one' = much larger dia. than PS. AAaand just for reference my old '95 had the same big/little config when I replaced each of its motors over 16 years, so no big woop or unexpected surprise when seeing the same on the '96 that replaced it.

Hopefully some other guys with '96 V03 can weigh whether they got the expected and normal V03 big/little combo as I have, or just two little motors per this reported "'96 year only change".

HATH


EDIT: I'll sure look into doing the 150w upgrade mod if/whenever needing to replace the primary PS motor, while also making sure it doesn't already have the 150w motor there as already listed for V03, which both my cars have.
 

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BALLSS Thanks for the pictures. Thumnails may be smaller but they are on the forum and may outlast 3rd party picture hosts.


BALLSS and 96Black, you both say your 96 is stock but you show the V03 cooling fans(one 240W). Would you both check what cooling system your SPI sticker shows? The rumor is the 240W was 94 only.



.
MY SPI says V03. 96 Impala SS, original owner

The 2 out of car pics I posted are not my fans, they were pics from the forum member I bought the radiator from. The in car pic is my car....if there is any difference.

Regarding the 96 fan relay note in one post. I did have issues with the melting relay block underhood and did install the GM TSB outboard fan relay. I have since installed Garys dual external fan relay mod...although mine is quite different from what I see on his site now. Mine has both relays mounted in a box that I have mounted in front of my radiator. Garys install instructions that came with my kit (way back when) had mounting the box inside the bumper. IMHO making it "awkward" to access the relays should I ever need to. I have not but prefer the more accessible location (pic). Garys kit now looks to have the relays mounted on firewall behind stock underhood fuse block...as did GM's TSB fix
 

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Right-click, saved.


Funny about this though:
"Note that the '94 V03 (Extra Capacity Cooling) option uses a 150-watt primary (RH) fan, and an upgraded 240-watt secondary (LH) fan. In '95-'96 the V03 package was revised and no longer included an upgraded 240-watt secondary fan. Instead the standard 100-watt secondary fan was used, which is the same as the base cooling system."


GM intra-office memo distro appears lacking lol.



Using RockAuto's listings for '96 FW I checked and my DS side is 4" dia., and the PS is 3 1/4" dia. Just as listed for any other year V03. My '96 Impala SS is identical setup. I could not tell you if the PS is the 100w or 150w, but RockAuto makes no mention of either wattage in any of their descriptions for the small motor. Buuutt, since I read in this thread that those two can be swapped for each other, then it's gotta be one or the other. I'm presuming 150w as described about everywhere for V03, which I have. Except one RockAuto listing part no. refers to one motor that used for PS whether reg. or extra duty. So what is the real wattage of the 'specified expected 150w" PS motors nowadays? Maybe other sites have better descriptions, but now I remember why all the confusion when ordering my last motor - that is, the big DS one.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thank for all the replies! I'm still sorting through everything and trying to figure out what is going on here, but I am almost wondering now if maybe someone just modified these fans once before? Are there possibly supposed to be metal inserts inside the leg mounting points that were maybe drilled out on mine?

Balls, difficult to see in your photo but do your fan legs sit on top of the mounting posts? Again, hard to see, but your mounting posts look the same as mine which means if the fans ARE the same, they would have to sit on top of the posts and not over them in order to work correctly.


I took some pics to better explain my situation. You can see the upper and lower clip issue in the picture. The flange is simply too wide and FSR claims this is because it was build for the "HD" radiator which has a 3/8ths thicker core. Seems like they may be mistaken on that option.


Here is the weirder issue though. The posts appear to be the same posts that were on the old LT1 style FSR radiator that I sold, and I KNOW a forum member test fit his fans on that one before I purchased it from him and he said it all fit fine. What I'm thinking is maybe the fans are supposed to have smaller bolt holes, possibly with a metal integrated washer or something that somebody dremeled out on mine? I know the fans were messed with as all the hardware mounting them to my radiator was different.

Again, none of it is too big of a deal. I can bolt the upper and lower clips on to the flange and I can just pick up spacers to sit over the mounting posts on the radiator to let the fan legs sit on top of nicely.

Balls, do the fan mounting legs, radiator mounting posts (or both) look different from yours?
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
The angles of my pictures were pretty bad. To further explain, when I let the fan mounting leg sit OVER the mounting post, the fan blade will touch the end tank (PICTURE 2). If I sit the fan mounting leg ON TOP of the mounting post, the fan seems to sit pretty much perfectly level over the radiator like it should (PICTURE 3). The last two pics just show how I can't mount the fans on top of the mounting posts because the hole is too large.

The fans look the same as the the one in BALL'S picture. It's almost like i'm just missing some sort of mounting spacer that goes over the posts in the radiator and under the mounting legs of the fan.
 

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For the fan mounts: Top hole 1/4 inch, tank hole 0.58 inch, and the bottom is slotted.
On my stock car the mount sits on top of the post. 1/2 inch post compared to the tank, 1 inch higher than the core.(finger measured). It seems you may have to use a fender washer to make the mount sit on top of the post? Maybe this pic will help. Sorry about the size but I do not have time for this right now.
 

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SSandman

I used flat washers on both sides of the fan ear basically a fender washer that fits "in" the recess and a flange head bolt to hold the fan ear on the post of the FSR

Been several years since I installed it and I can't remember if I had these flat washers on the ears or not on the stock radiator.

I may have had the same issue as you and just put washers on either side so the fan mounting ear sat on top of the FSR mounting post. But again I can't remember if they were mounted the same way with the stock radiator which for me was the 9C1 one with the curved DS side tank because I had/have the 9C1 external oil cooler. BTW the oil cooler lines do go around my FSR without issue

My top fan mounting clip just fit fine, no mods to it. My FSR radiator is considerably thicker than the stock one was.
 

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The big bolt hole is just for quick installation. The bolt head is made with a washer under it so it clamps the large hole. Instead of a fender washer maybe a rubber from a swaybar end link would go over the post and set the height for the fan mount?
 
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