[95wagon]

Yes LS7 pump is completely different as it is a two stage ( second for dry sump scavenge)
Had a memory lapse with you running an iron block.
Yeah, the 10 per 1000 , if memory serves it was a Chrysler engineer a million years ago and somehow the world latched on to it.
Insanely general , generalization.
Sooo, many design factors would change the amount of galley pressure required to have the correct amount of oil at the bearing.

 

[Kittyboy]

Kittyboy, are you running a pickup brace? I guess it's also good to check the O ring (correct o ring, not pinched on installation) although everything I have heard about the O rings seem to indicate oil pressure would be VERY low if it were the incorrect size or damaged.

Hey SSandman, I also installed an Improved Racing oil pan baffle, ICT pickup tube brace with Melling brand 'black' color O-ring, stock CTS-V2 oil pan. Figured it can't hurt having a pickup tube brace and baffle installed. I found the extra 3mm diameter 'black' Melling O-ring fit a bit more snug on my tube than the OEM GM 'blue' color.

Checked some logs, appears 30-34psi 850rpm idle pressure, 45ish psi cruise, 50-59psi WOT using Mobile1 10w40. The pressure seems to follow the old NA rule 10psi per 1000rpm with 10w40, not that it's critical, but I felt that it would give me a bit more buffer on the bearings at WOT. Prior using 5w30 Moble1 I would see 42-48psi WOT. I recall slight pressure drop using 5w30 at 5600rpm at 200* engine temps, idle would also drop into the high 20s.

Since using the 10w40 I have not logged oil pressure drops at WOT for what it's worth. I am going to run the current oil 3k then get an oil report before changing, I'll follow up with you the results. I am attaching a PDF of my 500, 1000, 2000 mile oil reports using 5w30 Mobile1.

You are correct GM lists 6500rpm max for B15, it was the 6665 pump I was referring too. I'm still a bit concerned about cavitation with the stock B15 pump exceeding 6200rpm from what I've read. Also realizing different flow/pressure requirements for 'priority main' blocks.

I live in WA where the air is ideal for making power. However, I'm running 92 so my spark advance is on the lower side at WOT 14-16*. I run rich in order to advance the timing a bit 10.5AFR keeping the exhaust heat cooler. In the future I'm going to consider some boost additives to see if I can advance a bit more without knock.

Have you borescope your engine yet? I have a couple cylinders and have some images.

 

[SSandman]

Wow, sorry for the delay on this. Had some victories with the car followed by some setbacks. Found a new tuner, RK Tuning in NJ. He got the car driving amazing. Shifting seamlessly, part throttle shift points all felt dead on, idle was rock steady, trans temps were actually 20 degrees cooler cruising around in 20 degrees HOTTER weather than they were with the previous tuner. Unfortunately I think the previous tuner may have done some damage to the trans when the 3-4 shifts were happening way too soon/slow and the other day I lost the 3-4 clutch pack on a WOT pull. The trans is still on warranty from Performabilt so hopefully we can get to the bottom of it.


I did have a chance to take some video of oil pressure though. I'll host/post the videos when I get a chance but for now....

Mobile 5w30
Hot idle, summer day (80ish degrees) about 25-28psi with 680rpm idle
Cruising at 2100RPM- 48-50psi
WOT jumped right up to 70psi by 5500 rpm and rose up to maybe 71 by the shift point at 6500. On the video i'm watching I let off just before it hit redline so unfortunately I can't tell you if it dropped off at all after 6500 but it didn't seem like it was letting up at all by 6500.Tuner had the car up to 7k a few times on the dyno and didn't note any issues.


My current tuner swears that mobile is the worst synthetic out there for thinning out when hot. There is a pretty decent pressure drop when hot when using it, but I have been pretty happy with the oil pressure at WOT so haven't bothered trying something different or thicker yet.

Car made just over 700whp on the dyno with the new 9.06 lower pulley I installed. Pulls like an absolute freight train but you wouldn't know it wasn't a stock impala when cruising around. Crack the throttle though and the thing is VIOLENT. The boost comes on so fast, it just feels like it's trying everything it can to break every driveline part on the car and turn the drag radials into a ball of fire. Really thought it was time for an 80E, but Performabilt is swearing to me they have heavier cars making more power with this trans. Should know for sure what happened once I can get it out and get it apart.

 

[95wagon]

Oil
Go Motul 300V or go home

 

[Marky Dissod]

Oil
Go Motul 300V or go home

For the love of our engines, please, do tell us some more?

 

[95wagon]

Its not for everyone .
Sandman is making more power than some of our racecars although he does not run wide open throttle for extended periods of time.
My personal street experience,
One of my cars is a big inch , small oil pan , big gear car.
34-3600 normal highway rpm.
After about an hour the pressure would start creeping down.
To the point I would have to slow down to get the revs down below 3000.
The pressure would then creep back up.
Car does not have an oil temp gauge as it is a "restoration"
Same weight 300V the issue went away.
I surmize it is both the lubrication not making as much heat and not thinning at elevated temperature
My LS7, I use it because I do not have a cooler and the engine gets worked.
My stock LS3 never gets worked very hard and M1 is just fine.
Most all the race cars we use it and it has proven its self , to me , with what the bearings look like on teardowns and good pressure when they are in extreme conditions.

To stop the pissing match before it starts,
You have a favorite oil brand and or type ?
Use that .

 

[Marky Dissod]

Don't have a fave, per se, for several reasons.
Any Group IV synthetic 5W30 is good.
Any Group IV synthetic 0W30 is preferred for winter, so I'm ALWAYS looking for it.
Whenever I find a 'deal' on any Group IV synthetic 5W30 or 0W30, I'll take it.

Don't yet know where to find Motul 300V, but I'll keep an eye out.

 

[91ss]

big inch , small oil pan , big gear car.
34-3600 normal highway rpm.
After about an hour the pressure would start creeping down.
To the point I would have to slow down to get the revs down below 3000.
The pressure would then creep back up.

Maybe more a function of aeration of the oil?

 

[95wagon]

If it was ,
I dont see it taking about an hour to start happening
I dont see it taking as long as it did to recover
I dont see changing to the same weight Motul 300V solving it.
Also didnt happen at short high RPM runs.
I'll keep pouring it in cars I care about.

 

[stonebreaker]

Maybe more a function of aeration of the oil?

That's sure what it sounds like, doesn't it? If it was the oil losing viscosity from heating up, seems like it would happen a lot sooner than an hour.

 

[atlantadan]

M1 5W30 - oil pressure drops to 23 or so after a highway drive and sitting at the light at the end of the ramp. If I never get on the highway, the pressure never gets below 27 - no matter how hard I'm running it around town. Same coolant temp. It's weird, but never was enough for me to do anything about it. I may try the Motoul and see if it changes.

 

[Marky Dissod]

OK, I've heard enough.
Til I find out why Mobil1 slacks off on long drives (once a month or so, I'll drive ≈500 miles in a day), if I buy or use Mobil1, it'll be Group IV 0W40 or 5W40 - assuming I find 0W40 or 5W40.
Meanwhile, I'll be on the lookout for Motul 300V ...

 

[sherlock9c1]

Sorry to hear about the 3-4 clutchpack. I took my Impala off the road a few months back due to a failing fuel pump and also excessive line pressure fluctuation under load (yet another reason to ignore a trans temp gauge in favor of a line pressure gauge). At 700whp there is no room for error on line pressure to the 3-4 clutchpack. Do you have torque management active? I would highly recommend it for driveline life.

 

[SSandman]

So to add to the story a bit, this car has been simultaneously the biggest let down and the biggest success at the same time. I say that because the car exceeds all my expectations of performance. It's mind blowingly fast, and the power delivery is what I can only describe as being violent. It's exactly what I wanted, tons of low end torque and factory street manners. It handles amazing and is a dream to cruise on the highway.

The let down being how little I've been able to do with the car because of the plague of tuning and trans issues.
Here's the update on the trans situation.

Frank from performabuilt tore the trans apart and told me it rolled the overdrive sprag and smoked the 3-4 clutch. I had a good feeling the sprag rolled because the first symptom I had was a loud bang when the car hooked up very hard after spinning from about 20mph till 50mph from a roll.Hot day, sticky surface and the 345's decided they wanted to make an attempt at traction (kind of a first lol). The next pull from a roll is when the 3-4 clutch smoked.

I got the transmission back after being repaired, installed it, took it out for about 30miles of street driving and a half throttle spin fest pull from a dig. Still had 2nd so I figured it was a servo issue. Took the servo apart and seemed like way too much clearance between the pin. Took it out (this is not my 5th time removing a trans in this car in a little over a year) and brought it to Performabuilt. Frank said the tolerances of the case were off causing their billet servo to not fit correctly. the o ring held it in place when they had it on the dyno and probably the first 20 or so miles I drove it, but then it broke loose and with nothing to take up the slack it wouldn't engage 4th.

I know the sprag failure could happen with any transmission when you're playing with this much weight and power but I want to minimize the chance of ever having to pull the trans again. 5 times is more than enough for this life time. I asked performabuilt if they could credit me towards an 80e but they didn't have any cores, so they did the right thing and said they'd refund my purchase.

As we speak i'm having Accurate Transmission in CT building me what should be a beast of a 4l80e and Circle D is making the changes needed to my converter to work with an 80e while maintaining my current flex plate.
My tuner also suggested I go multi disk lockup with the 80e so that we can lock the converter at WOT. Not something I felt I needed for E/T, but it's going to be a good way to keep trans temps ln check if I ever take the car on a road course.

Looking forward to this hopefully being the last of the trans problems with this car. Only downside is I think I'm going to have to swap out the 3.73's for something lower. I already wasn't too happy with the RPM on the highway with my 26" tall tires and the .75OD isn't going to help. Car seems to make way too much power too hook up with anyway so I don't think the steeper gears are doing me any favors. the longer 1st gear of the 80e is definitely going to be helpful as well. 1st was completely useless with the 60, you'd spin through it in about .2 seconds as if you were on ice.

 

[nsaness]

At your torque level you could comfortably have a 3.23 gear in there. That said, a 3.42 might be enough.
I'm sure your transmission issues are solved now. The 4L80 can be built to be very stout.

If you get tired of fighting with that car, DM me to buy it!
I am also experiencing tuning and transmission pains with mine, but every day, I am so sorry I did not do an LS swap when I was at that crossroads...

I wish you the best of luck! Keep going, your car makes me weak in the knees. I love it!

 

[95wagon]

As they say
" cheer up , things could be worse"
"So I cheered up and sure as **** things got worse"

simultaneously the biggest let down and the biggest success at the same time

Well, better than nothing breaks and the car is a lame ass stone.😉🙂

 

[toonwarrior]

Well if you run into more trans troubles after that, t56 time 🙄

 

[stonebreaker]

So how much horsepower and torque are you making at the moment?

Incidentally, those stickers on the door in my avatar are transmission kills. Welcome to the transmission aces club!

 

[Marky Dissod]

Only downside is I think I'm going to have to swap out 3.73 for something lower.
I already wasn't too happy with the RpM on the highway with my 26" tall tires and the .75OD isn't going to help.
Car seems to make way too much power to hook up with anyway, so I don't think the steeper gears are doing me any favors.
The longer 1st gear of the 80e is definitely going to be helpful as well.
1st was completely useless with the 60, you'd spin through it in about .2 seconds as if you were on ice.

Just thinking aloud:
Had I the resources to drive an LSA-blown LSX B15 376 putting 700horses to the tire, I'd at least wonder if a 200-4R could be built to withstand it reliably ...
then I'd start thinking about a 6L90E.

CTS-Vs came with 6L90Es and ... 3.27, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[sherlock9c1]

Sorry you had those issues with the transmission. The sprag issue could be mitigated with Sonnax heavy duty 2-3 shift valve, and the billet servo pin length issue is really weird since they make them extra long and you have to custom-grind them to fit. Those 345 tires and steep gear ratio aren't helping matters either. I'm running 3.23 and street tires in my wagon for a reason.