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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I R/R'd my ball joints (all four) about 3 weeks ago and today when I was doing plugs/wires, I noticed that the upper ball joint boots are slipping down on the metal 'cup' that goes over the lower part of the upper ball joint. I must have done something wrong during the install. I couldn't find any way for the lip on the boot to get 'pinched' or 'retained'. Since the metal cup is smooth and there is grease involved, the boot will slip down on the inboard side but won't completely come off. I'll try to get pics tomorrow if it's absolutely necessary.

Sorry so long but give me a hint here boys.

Thanks.
 
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Although there are different types, typically the steel "cup" goes on after the rubber to pinch it against the joint.
That is to say you put the joint through the arm, slide the boot on the bottom, put the cup on over it , put the bolts in , then tighten.
Gerry
 
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
That's what I was afraid of. However, I seem to recall the instruction saying that the cup went on first. I wish I had kept them so I could look again. I'm sure you're right though... the way it is now certainly doesn't seem right!

Thanks.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I took at look at the Haynes manual and I'm 100 percent sure I did it wrong now. I usually don't stray very far from my '96 FSMs but sometimes the pictures in the Haynes manual speak volumes. :(

Can someone please verify this procedure if you've done MOOG ball joints recently?

1. Slide rubber boot onto ball joint.
2. Slide assembly through upper control arm.
3. Slide metal dust shield over rubber boot from bottom.
4. Install bolts and torque to specs (12 ft lbs).

I'm going to try to use the bolt/nut/socket method to pop it loose and move the boot and dust shield where they belong.

Let me know if you think this is right... anyone.

Thanks to all.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Looks like you and I are the only two lurking in Suspension right now. I'm wondering the exact same thing as I'm putting my suspension back together. I can go back pretty easily and change things though. It didn't seem like the boot could fit underneath the metal cup though, so I assembled it the way you did initially.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Yeah, I agree... it 'looked' like the way it should have gone when I installed it. ;) According to the Haynes manual, it says to do it like I outlined in my last post. I know that hundreds of people on here have done this so I'm just hoping one of them will fill us in.

It shouldn't be too bad to make it right on mine either - as long as I can get past the RED locktite. :eek:

I guess we'll just stay tuned!
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hi, did mine three years ago and they'd be hard pressed to have 2,000km on them, the MONEY PIT has been layed up until recently! Anyhow I think that with the pin pointing down the boot is sliped on, then the metal shell, then the whole works is installed from the top side of the upper control arm. Also I believe the bolts go in from underneath. Sure hope I got that right; I'm pretty sure. GOOD LUCK!
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
That's almost what Haynes shows with the exception of the metal cup. They show it going on from the bottom (after the ball joint/boot are installed from the top). If worse comes to worse, I'll try it your way unless the cup won't fit completely over the boot. If it's too tight, I'll put the cup in from the bottom - that will space it out from the ball joint a little further.

The saga continues...
Thanks for the response!
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
hey GMguy -

I went back and redid my UBJs last night. I stuck the balljoint through the UCA, then put the boot on from the bottom, and then the cup on, then tightened everything down and it all came into place. I put the boot on from the bottom to guarrantee I had a nice solid metal-to-metal connection between the UBJ surface and the UCA, because the UCA/UBJ is dealing predominantly with a downward pulling force. That way, the boot and cup are out of the way on the underside of the UCA.

BTW - on one UBJ thread, AutocroSSer posted to put red loctite on the replacement UBJ bolts, but the PPM kit I got came with locknuts that weren't going ANYWHERE, so I didn't bother with loctite.

So I was all proud of myself until I went to put the shocks in and I discovered that it is possible to reassemble your UCA/LCA/spindle/spring and NOT have the spring properly seated in the upper perch. Doh!
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thanks for the research partner. Do you still have the Moog instruction sheet that came with it? I don't remember it getting into this much detail. After all, I actually looked at the instructions and still screwed it up.


The boot itself is smaller than the hole in the UCA, isn't it? I would think so. If that's the case, you could have slipped the boot on first, before you stuck the joint in the UCA and come out with the same thing..... metal cup still goes on the bottom. Agree? I'm going to fix mine tomorrow. I've got it parked now until I can make time.

Thanks!
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I should have added that before I modified the installation, I also saw what you reported - the inboard side of the UBJ boot was already slid down most of the way off the cup, and this was before the car was even taken off the jackstands! I'm glad I saw this post and modified the setup.

All I have at this point is the FSM. Doesn't help too much with the aftermarket suspension components, particularly balljoints, because there's so many differences, even between the different levels of kits offered by PPM.

I did not try the boot on the UBJ before pushing it through the UCA, but what's the point? Pure devil's advocate here, but just thinking.
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I was just pointing out that both ways would be the same as long as the boot and metal cup ended up in the same position when it was all said and done.

I'm glad you got them redone... at least you caught it before you got it all back together.
 
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Boy did my old grey matter fail me yesterday!!!!! First off I want to offer my appologies. Crawled under the car this A.M. and confirmed the install. Balljoint from top with or without boot and boot retainer cup from underneath with bolts in from down under, nuts on top. As a side note; the self locking nuts are only good for two or three re+re's. After that they are worn and loose their grip on the bolt threads, hence LOCKTITE. Once again my appologies but this time I know I got it right!
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
klauSS, Thank you! Don't apologize. I was entertaining educated guesses at the time as well. ;)

I appreciate you crawling back under to take a look for me. I'm going to try to knock this out tomorrow.

And yes, I do have loctite....unfortunately, I used it during the initial install as well. We'll see how it goes...

Have a good week.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Agreed on those locknuts. As I put them on the second time, they were nowhere near as tight as they were the first time. Not loose, but not tight either. I put the nuts on the topside so everytime I take the tire off, I can inspect them.

I want to make one more point that I discovered as I was greasing all the joints. As I mentioned, I put the balljoint through the UCA and then put the boot on from the bottom. I discovered that the only downside of this is that if you don't have a perfect seal between the UCA/balljoint/boot, when you go to grease the BJ, the grease will leak out around these surfaces. So.. I guess if I was going to do it all over again, I'd put the boot on the balljoint and then stick it through, then put the metal cup on the bottom.
 
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