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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have been researching this for some time and there is tons of info on other forums but not much on here. I learned a lot at sounddeadenershowdown.com. Fuzzcar has also been a big help from here.

So far I have ordered 120 square foot of Second Skins Damplifier Pro from here. I plan on using this on the doors, floors, roof, and trunk.

I am still researching and looking for input on what I will put down over the entire car for a spray on or brush on sound deadner.

After both those I will put down a layer of closed cell foam with a layer of radiant barrier attached on each side of it. Sourced 100 square foot of that from ebay here. Plan is to put this on the doors, floors, roof, and trunk. This will help with heating/cooling, add some sound deadening, and act as a decoupler for the final layer of mass loaded vinyl (MLV).

The final layer of MLV will be put on the doors, floors, and trunk. I sourced 100 square foot of that off Ebay as well here. Still need to find a glue or tape for the seams of this.
So to start the project off I gutted the interior and trunk. Had a couple spots of surface rust that I ground off and hit with some POR 15. Got a little out of hand with that stuff and ended up coating most of the floor and trunk with it. Let me know if you guys have any input or ideas. Will be updating as supplies come in and time allows for install.

 

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I wish you the best of luck. And my day job makes me cringe whenever I see MLV.

-Brian
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks Steaksauce!

Sshockr do you use MLV at your day job? Why dont you like it? I have been trying to source it localy but I have had no luck. Most people have never heard of it around here.
 

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I used three different types of glue and industrial strength Velcro.

The first and strongest type I purchased was Barge Cement, I purchased it online but usually leather working and horse shoeing supply shops like Tandy Leather sell it or a similar version. The good thing about this stuff is its extremely sticky but it also does not completely harden, it remains slightly pliable. My concern with glue that hardens is the foam would just tear off it. I used this stuff on vertical surfaces and anywhere I thought needed the most adhesion.



Because I stretched my project out over many many months and ended up using the barge cement for a lot of other projects, once I ran out of that I used DAP Contact Cement. This worked pretty well and I'm honestly not sure if I really needed the barge cement or not. I got this at Home Depot or Lowes



The other product I used was just for when I wanted to stick something lightly like large sections of LLP that sat flat against the floor. 3M Super 80 spray adhesive. I think I had to order this stuff. This would be good for sticking CCF to MLV. Don't settle for the Super 77 that most auto parts places carry, its junk compared to the 80.



The Velcro I used was purchased from www.sounddeadenershowdown.com. This Velcro is no BS walmart crap. He also sells a specific contact cement type adhesive called HH-66 which supposedly is optimized to stick to vinyl. I don't know, I've never used it.




Here's how I would tackle it:

Make sure your floorpans are as clean and rust free as is acceptable to you. I scrubbed them, wiped them down with acetone and painted them with POR15. Whether you paint them or not you want a clean surface to stick your butyl rubber deadener to. I gave them the white rag treatment. IE they were not clean until I could wipe a white rag across them and not get it dirty. (you already did this)

Stick Deadener, focus on large flat spots in sheet metal. Make sure it is pressed down really well, I used various rollers and a tennis/golf/pool ball worked pretty well in some spots. Any air bubbles, slice them with a razor and press them down. They way this stuff works is by making full contact with the metal.

Don't use the liquid deadeners unless you can leave your car disassembled for several weeks. This stuff keeps getting drier as long as it can remain exposed to air. The manufacturer will have specific instructions on how long to let it dry.

Study your surfaces. Draw out a plan to have the least amount of cuts in your MLV barrier as possible! I did not do this as good as I could have had I used the rolls of MLV and CCF as opposed to the sheets of LLP. **** measure twice and cut once. You gonna measure many many times and cut only where its needed. Test fit, mark, cut again, test fit, mark, cut again, and on and on and on. DO NOT GLUE ANYTHING at this point.

Then once the MLV is cut to how you want it, lay it on a stretched out piece of CCF and mark around the edge. Now there may be sections where you decide you don't have the clearance to allow both the MLV and the CCF, its okay to leave some gaps of coverage with CCF. Its just a cushioning/decoupling layer.

Determine the main areas you are going to have to pay extra attention to adhere properly. Vertical spots, weird dips and bends, etc.

Now here is a fork in the road...

You can either use glue and/or Velcro to stick your barrier down. I used glue, but if I did it again, I would use Velcro with glue only in critical spots. So its removable in case I got a better car or wrecked mine and wanted to switch all the parts to a new one or parted it out and someone wanted pre-cut sound barrier.

Either way in the critical spots. Or anywhere that you attach a Velcro strip, cut an appropriately sized hole in the CCF and attach the Velcro or the glue directly to the MLV. I would do this just in case the MLV separates from the CCF (which should only be a concern on vertical surfaces).

When you start actually gluing the barriers down, get everything layed in place how you want it, the roll up the edges and glue in sections.

Once you get done use all your scraps to cover any seams or gaps.

Another tip, anywhere that you remove wires or clips that hold wiring harnesses in place (like the kick panels) Take a few pics before so you can see how it goes back. Part of the factories anti-rattle plan was making sure stuff was secured and not loose where it can giggle against a panel or something.

Another thing on the glues, FOLLOW the directions. If it says apply the glue to each surface and let it sit for X amount of minutes DO IT! It will make it stick together quicker and better so you don't have to hold it as long.

Here is a link to my thread on my soundproofing I posted on an audio forum

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...45551-1994-chevy-caprice-sound-deadening.html
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
So I called Second Skin Audio , very helpful guys over there, and they said the black on the back of the damplifier pro is actually a primer so a roll on bed liner would have no trouble sticking to it. I used Herculiner in the past to do the inside of a Jeep Wrangler tub so I started reading up on that. Says it will stick to a lot of stuff including some plastics. Got me thinking I could put a layer of that on the back side of the door panels since a lot of squeaks/rattles come from our flimsy panels. I would coat the entire floor, rear seat area, trunk and possibly the door panels with it. Thoughts on this idea? Probably going to freshen up the front sides of the panels with some SEM as well while they are out. Anyone got the correct color from SEM for the 96 SS interior?
 

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Originally I planned to use an epoxy based fiberglass to strengthen the door panels. I decided against it because it seemed like a PITA with lots of potential to mess up. All it has to do is leak through the gaps between the upper part of panel and the lower and you have a mess. Same might go for the bedliner, depending on how thick it is.

I ended up using a plastic welder and bondo-glass to reinforce the weak area where the upper and lower meet. Topped it all off with some damplifier pro and it worked rather well.

Door panels feel substantially tougher and less flimsy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Good looking out. Had not thought of that. Maybe I will seal the seams with damplier pro first and then coat. I will have to look them over and access the situation. This was just an idea I had while at work.
 

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Good looking out. Had not thought of that. Maybe I will seal the seams with damplier pro first and then coat. I will have to look them over and access the situation. This was just an idea I had while at work.
You could test it with water to see if it will leak through.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I came across that stuff while searching for local products to use. I googled it and seems its fairly common to add it in vehicles. Its even got an R value of 3. Reviews on the adhesive were not very good though.
 

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Sshockr do you use MLV at your day job? Why dont you like it? I have been trying to source it localy but I have had no luck. Most people have never heard of it around here.
My dayjob is a weights engineer for business jets, and anytime the acoustics guys ask for more leaded vinyl, I'm typical the guy that has to say no because its heavy. I know it works well and its not by any means a bad product. Its just heavy,and my job is to keep the airplane as light as possible. Hence why I asked about coverage of the whole panel vs strategic placement in the middle. I know some King Airs actually have hundreds of tiny tuning forks glued to the insides of the skins to reduce the interior noise.

Sometimes I can find it at the local surplus yard.

-Brian
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Friday was like Christmas morning when I got home. Sound deadener, Foil/Closed cell foam, and my MLV showed up.



Its not a great pic but I was trying to show the differanc of the Damplifier vs the Damplifier Pro. Pro is a lot thicker. So thick that I thought it was going to be a pain to install, but it was actually a lot easier than I ever thought it was going to be.

Turns out 120 square foot of this stuff goes a long way. I started off thinking I would would do the 25-50% coverage that is recommended but soon realized I had more than enough and ended up doing almost 100% coverage. I know that there is a point of diminished return after you add so much but being my first time and not knowing the best places to install I figured this way I would be better off safe than sorry.






I ended up cutting some 2.5" strips and using it to reinforce the seems on the door panels. Really helped to make them feel more solid.



After getting all the Damplifier Pro installed I wanted to top coat the POR 15 paint in the spots that did not get covered with the CLD. Just like the last step I took this overboard as well and ended up coating the entire floor and most of the trunk.



I ended up finding a lot of stuff that needed attention while doing this project. One of the rear arm rest brackets was only held in by one rivet and the rest were just rattling around in there. Also found a socket inside the front driverside door while installing the CLD on the outer skin. Wondering if its from the factory or previous owners repair. The module for the remote door locks was not mounted down on the parcel shelf. Just a lot of little things that can cause rattles and squeaks.

Having the interior out has also got me contemplating adding some 6.5" component speakers up front. Also got me back on track for gettting my overhead console installed.
 

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If I am reading this correctly you did use the damplifier on the inside of the outter door skin, correct? That area is going to be one of the biggest returns in deadening. Also while you have the door panels off go ahead and remove your side mirrors and add extra foam (or how ever you decide to seal it) to the area that mounts against the door. According to this thread its a common cause for wind noise. I have not done mine yet and do notice wind noise coming from that area.

http://www.impalassforum.com/vBulletin/showthread.php?t=249729&highlight=mirror+wind+noise
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
If I am reading this correctly you did use the damplifier on the inside of the outter door skin, correct? That area is going to be one of the biggest returns in deadening. Also while you have the door panels off go ahead and remove your side mirrors and add extra foam (or how ever you decide to seal it) to the area that mounts against the door. According to this thread its a common cause for wind noise. I have not done mine yet and do notice wind noise coming from that area.

http://www.impalassforum.com/vBulletin/showthread.php?t=249729&highlight=mirror+wind+noise
Yea, I used about a sheet and a half on both front door outer skins, and one sheet on the outer rear door skins. Giving it the knock test it really makes it sound much more solid. Thanks for the idea for the backs of the door panels. It worked great. I did not fiberglass like you did yours but I did seal up as many of the holes in the door with CLDs as possible. You think some of the dampliefer pro or a piece of MLV would work for sealing up the Mirrors?
 

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Yea, I used about a sheet and a half on both front door outer skins, and one sheet on the outer rear door skins. Giving it the knock test it really makes it sound much more solid. Thanks for the idea for the backs of the door panels. It worked great. I did not fiberglass like you did yours but I did seal up as many of the holes in the door with CLDs as possible. You think some of the dampliefer pro or a piece of MLV would work for sealing up the Mirrors?
Not likely. You need something to seal a gap. Some kind of foam might work. Maybe a doubled or tripled up piece of your CCF/foil.

Here is a picture of the area they are talking about on a junk mirror. There is normally a triangular piece of foam that goes in here, over time I guess it loses some of its expandability and no longer presses firm against the door sealing out the air. One could use the existing piece of foam as a pattern, cutting a new piece slightly larger than the old. Put both the new and old piece back in the mirror (or just the new if using a thick foam). Then potentially run a couple beads of silicone along the plastic edges of the mirror housing that makes contact.

 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Got it. I was not really sure what part they were reffering to in the other thread since the pics were deleted. I will have to pull the mirrors and check it out. Thanks again.
 

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How soon until reassembly?

I wonder which is better, the 3M accoustic stuff or that silver insulation you got?
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
How soon until reassembly?

I wonder which is better, the 3M accoustic stuff or that silver insulation you got?
Got to let the Herculiner dry out good and the smell to dissapate some. I would imagine the 3M would be better for sound but since it does not have any reflective coating the silver stuff I have would be better for heat/cool. Just guessing though as I have never used either. I will be using that stuff first as the headliner will be first to get reienstalled. The to do list really piled up as I removed the interior. Lots of projects to get done before its all put back together. Just HAS to be done before June so we can go on Power Tour. :D
 
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