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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My 95 9c1 finally has VA Antique tags! No more emission tests! Time to replace the emission friendly 224/230 112LSA LE cam with a new one.
LE recommends a 230/238 110LSA with my 357 - stock crank, Scat 6 in rods, 40 over Mahle pistons, LE2 heads, Edge 3400 & 4.10 gears. Looking
at possible gains of 30-40hp.

Going to run it by the guy who built my little old 357. He may be helpful ; ) My 357 build for your viewing pleasure.

Along with the cam swap, I'm looking at swapping the CIA Gen 1 TriYs with 1 3/4 in Quad-1s. Don't know what kind of gains these will get with the
recommended cam but suspect a good amount at the top end. Could be wrong.

Just wanted to share and get some feedback from you all. Just enjoying my 9c1, Moonshine Runner, and hoping to maximize her performance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Good to see you man!

What are you thinking for your refresh?
 

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That's awesome! There's nothing like having a solid running setup, getting some use out of it and then upgrading it to "phase 2". Always fun tapping even more potential out of an already great setup.
Take some videos when it's done, we need more cool videos here on these boards lol
 
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Iirc, Debski’s website for Cherry Bomb showed extensive testing of Quad vs. Tri, with Tri-ys resulting in lower ET’s. You can still find the page capture using one of those archive web engines.
I have a 231/239 LE spec cam in ERE-71-runs great, but mine is a 396. I wouldn’t want to run it on an engine with less cubes, but I’m not a drag racer and I go to bed early, act like my father all of a sudden, and mutter about those damn kids, so my opinion on cam duration means squat.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Iirc, Debski’s website for Cherry Bomb showed extensive testing of Quad vs. Tri, with Tri-ys resulting in lower ET’s. You can still find the page capture using one of those archive web engines.
I have a 231/239 LE spec cam in ERE-71-runs great, but mine is a 396. I wouldn’t want to run it on an engine with less cubes, but I’m not a drag racer and I go to bed early, act like my father all of a sudden, and mutter about those damn kids, so my opinion on cam duration means squat.
I remember that wealth of knowledge! That's going way back in the Forum.

My understanding is the TriYs cant be beat for a stock or modded LT1 under 5800 - 6000 rpms. Correct? The cam LE is recommending spins up just under 6800.

From LE: "The 232/240 cam will want to spin 6800 RPM in a 357 engine with LE2 heads. A 230/238 110 LSA camshaft would bring that down a hair and make slightly more mid range TQ if that would be better for you."

His "226/232 .578/.574 110 LSA. – 1900-6200 RPM NON-EMISSIONS version of 224/230 cam. Mild to choppy idle. Good HP/TQ through out and a very usable power band. Best choice for “most people” using stock bottom end. Minimum 2800 stall and 3.42 gears for B body. Comparable to Comp 467 XFI cam." may be an option also.

I will definitely run the headers by LE also. Once I hear back from Karl and LE, I will share with you all.
 

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I've got the comp 467 in a 355 with 6" rods and a good set of heads. It makes great power up top, but you have to be willing to wind it up north of 3000rpm before it starts feeling snappy. I made 373/375 on 18* of timing on the limp home spark table because I was on day 2 of my 24x tuning. Rev Limiter at 6200 and it hadn't started dropping off yet. Only one run for a club dyno day thing. Turned the timing up and it feels much better now.

-Brian
 

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Good to see you man!

What are you thinking for your refresh?
Probably have Karl do the rebuild and do a LE heads/cam setup. I just want something I won't feel bad revving out over 6k rpm once in a while when I want to stretch 3rd or 4th gear just a few seconds longer on some of them short straights on track.

I've got no idea what kind of power the stock 200k mile motor has been churning out, but I'd love to get something that'll crank out 350-400whp for another 100k street and track miles to better keep pace with all these hi-po factory beasts coming out these days.
 

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I wish CA had a "ok your car is old enough not to need smog check"....but unfortunately that year is 75 and older. Each smog test now they lower the # to pass and it will be impossible for a bone stock brand new Impala to pass that. Unfortunately the $200-$300 test, cough, is harder to find as the smog Nazi's are on the hunt for those shops. So far I have always passed....with "help" from Ed Wright on my tune but sadly the #'s threshold for smog keeps dropping. They simply want these cars off the road

I see a AZ registered car in my future.....
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Probably have Karl do the rebuild and do a LE heads/cam setup. I just want something I won't feel bad revving out over 6k rpm once in a while when I want to stretch 3rd or 4th gear just a few seconds longer on some of them short straights on track.

I've got no idea what kind of power the stock 200k mile motor has been churning out, but I'd love to get something that'll crank out 350-400whp for another 100k street and track miles to better keep pace with all these hi-po factory beasts coming out these days.
hey man, with your 6 speed and mad skilz you don't need anything radical.

My suggestion would be to refurbish the stock iron heads with a valve job, open up the exhaust ports to match the gasket, screw in studs, and bigger springs with 1.6 rollers. The problem with GM aluminum LT1 heads are they are 20+ years old and hard to find quality cores. You most likely will need to buy a set of new cores from Trick Flow for LE to port. The negative with the irons is the weight on the front end of your car. You maybe able to score a set of used LT1 aluminum heads but again, try and get aftermarket newer ones from TF. GM ones will be suspect. Give Nab a call. He has a set of Camaro heads from me that were refurbished with a valve job, gasket matched and springs.

Having Karl rebuild the SB is a great idea. It will be done right. Be aware that there is no cost difference between 30 over and 40 over Mahle pistons. Karl will most likely recommend replacing your stock pistons. My 357 is so balanced and just screams up top. Wants more. Nab told me it is one of the most smooth balances LT1s he's driven.

With my 96SS, I put the Crane 227 cam in my rebuilt 350 with refurbished stock iron heads. ran a best of 13.0 on the 1/4 mile. Don't remember the ET. LE has a nice cam for a stock motor that is similar to the Crane 227 - "218/224 .570/.565 111 LSA. – 1500-6000 RPM, Great low and mid range power with very mild idle and will easily pass emissions. Works with stock gear and factory converter. Comparable to popular Crane 227 cam and GM 845 cam." Maybe you can use my LE224/230 cam which is similar to the LT4 Hot Cam. If you are interested, I can hook you up. Or go with a custom cam from LE to meet your specific needs. Here's some of the cam info from LE - LE LT1 Cams

You have headers?

Can't wait to follow your build and get a ride in it at the track with the new motor.
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I wish CA had a "ok your car is old enough not to need smog check"....but unfortunately that year is 75 and older. Each smog test now they lower the # to pass and it will be impossible for a bone stock brand new Impala to pass that. Unfortunately the $200-$300 test, cough, is harder to find as the smog Nazi's are on the hunt for those shops. So far I have always passed....with "help" from Ed Wright on my tune but sadly the #'s threshold for smog keeps dropping. They simply want these cars off the road

I see a AZ registered car in my future.....
VA started doing the same tactic of making the test more strict to get older cars off the road. Happened with my 9c1. It passed the first time. never again after that.
 

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I wish CA had a "ok your car is old enough not to need smog check"....but unfortunately that year is 75 and older. Each smog test now they lower the # to pass and it will be impossible for a bone stock brand new Impala to pass that. Unfortunately the $200-$300 test, cough, is harder to find as the smog Nazi's are on the hunt for those shops. So far I have always passed....with "help" from Ed Wright on my tune but sadly the #'s threshold for smog keeps dropping. They simply want these cars off the road

I see a AZ registered car in my future.....
Would it be possible to keep two PCM's with two different tunes?

On one PCM have a tune that is only used to smog test the car, with no emphasis at all on performance.

Then on the other PCM you can go all out and do whatever you want.
 

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I wish CA had a "ok your car is old enough not to need smog check" … but unfortunately that year is 1975 and older. Each smog test now they lower the # to pass and it will be impossible for a bone stock brand new Impala SS to pass that. Unfortunately the $200-$300 test, cough, is harder to find as the smog Nazi's are on the hunt for those shops. So far I have always passed … with "help" from Ed Wright on my tune but sadly the #'s threshold for smog keeps dropping. They simply want these cars off the road.

I see a AZ registered car in my future …
1. When you say, 'with Ed Wright's help on my tune', guessing that includes 91 octane in the tank for the tune?

2. Have any of you Californians ever had the feeling that the C.A.R.B.'s 'certified catalytic converters' for IronBlock LT1 cars are actually worse than the regular ones, and that that's just another way for California to get your cars off the road sooner?

3. Pretty sure Ed Wright and other talented tuners can write an E85-specific tune.
Maybe that's another way to make it harder for the C.A.R.B. to discriminate against the LT1.

CA obviously only wants electrified cars on the road in the not-so-distant-future …
Would it be possible to keep two PCM's with two different tunes?

On one PCM have a tune that is only used to smog test the car, with no emphasis at all on performance.

Then on the other PCM you can go all out and do whatever you want.
Pretty soon this won't just be possible, it could wind up being a necessary evil.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Would it be possible to keep two PCM's with two different tunes?

On one PCM have a tune that is only used to smog test the car, with no emphasis at all on performance.

Then on the other PCM you can go all out and do whatever you want.
I did this. When I passed the one time I forgot to switch my race PCM with my emission PCM. Was never able to pass with neither after VA continued to make the testing stricter each year.
 
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Back on track now.

Got Karl's blessing on the recommended cam from LE and the 1 3/4 long tube QUAD-1. He agreed that the cam would be a great fit for my 357 and the QUAD-1's will give me more power at the higher rpm rang above 6500 without any loss in TQ.
 
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There are a lot of things that suck about living in Illinois, but I am very grateful that we have absolutely no emission testing outside of the Chicago area. No vehicle inspections, either.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Custom LE cam ordered and paid for. Unfortunately there are no more LT1 cam cores available nationally. Supply was impacted by COVID. LE was able to get 27 cores. Sometimes he is able to get one or two if he is lucky. Suppose to be a big shipment of cores, I assume from Asia, this April. If you have a project build and need a cam, you may want to get in line ASAP.

Also, a shout out to Lloyd Elliott. He's one cool dude and has a ton of LT1 knowledge that he is willing to share. The guy is slammed and the cam cores supply issue has made it much worse. Heads and cams are his side job. He called me and answered all my questions. Super patient and not a condescending dick and/or all about the sale mentality like some other business can be. LT1 market has been shrinking super fast over the years. If you want to keep our rides running and performing, remember to support the businesses that have supported our community over the years.

Now it's time to talk to Dan at Clear Image about some long tube headers.
 

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Lloyd is very helpful. I was also impressed with his customer service and how much time he was willing to spend in order to help me.

I'm running his 231/243 on a 110 LSA and I have been very happy. It's in a 388 with 3.73 gears and a 2800 stall. It drives better than I really expected. I'm sure you will be even more satisfied with your 4.10 gears and 3400 stall. I don't have any dyno numbers yet but I plan to move forward with a Torqhead conversion soon as there are no tuners around here for LTx cars. Looking forward to hearing about your updates.
 
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Would it be possible to keep two PCM's with two different tunes?

On one PCM have a tune that is only used to smog test the car, with no emphasis at all on performance.

Then on the other PCM you can go all out and do whatever you want.
Yes you can have 2 different PCM's. One for "play" and the other for "smog"

But.....you need to have your tuner (cough)...set all the IM monitors to read "ready" all the time as otherwise some will not show ready as it takes an insane amount of drive cycles to set them and with modified motors the CAT heat and EGR don't show as ready even though they are functioning even after years of driving
.

On 1/1/2019 CA changed their emission law to only allow 1, used to be 2, IM monitor to read not ready.

Both my regular performance tine and my "smog" tune have been set to have the IM read ready all the time so disconnecting battery or swapping PCM they always read immediately "ready :)
1. When you say, 'with Ed Wright's help on my tune', guessing that includes 91 octane in the tank for the tune?

2. Have any of you Californians ever had the feeling that the C.A.R.B.'s 'certified catalytic converters' for IronBlock LT1 cars are actually worse than the regular ones, and that that's just another way for California to get your cars off the road sooner?

3. Pretty sure Ed Wright and other talented tuners can write an E85-specific tune.
Maybe that's another way to make it harder for the C.A.R.B. to discriminate against the LT1.

CA obviously only wants electrified cars on the road in the not-so-distant-future …
Pretty soon this won't just be possible, it could wind up being a necessary evil.
we only have 91 octane as premium gas in CA so my tunes from Ed have always been for 91

Used to be able to buy 100 octane at 76 stations and on their site they had a grid showing X gallons of 100 added to 91 = x octane so you could "mix" and get 93. That was when 100 was $5 a gallon. Last I checked its over $8 now and in very limited stations. I don't F with that kind of dance so just have a 91 tune

Still I run 12:87 @ 106 mph

Yeah CA wants to go all electric by 2030 or 2035...whatever BS the politicians are trying to do. That will be for new cars so there will still be "gas powered" ones but the same suits keep changing the emission level standards to squeeze gas powered cars off the road as they have been doing for years now
 
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