So how many other FE1 Caprices came with quick steering? - Chevy Impala SS Forum
 
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-02-2017, 09:21 PM Thread Starter
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So how many other FE1 Caprices came with quick steering?

So, finally got a long weekend and some car time. Grabbed the impala gearbox that's been sitting in other garage for many years as it was going in the 91. Figured it was due for a home this weekend in the 95. But first needed front brakes as they haven't been touched in the 5 years of having it. So jack the front crank the wheel to the right to get to the caliper bolts. Left side done. Crank the wheel the other way... what, huh... why was that less than 3 turns???

Son of a gun. it already has one. Then looked to see if there is a spid for steering and sure enough, it has the N40 steering. Guess must be an option. Original owner was a fellow engineer that was long retired and getting too old to drive. Figuring he must have ordered it that way.
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-03-2017, 09:12 AM
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Think there were 3 steering ratios:

12.7to1 / slightly under 3 turns lock-to-lock:
All 9C1s & WXs, and I guess it was optional if you were one of the few who knew how to ask for it?

14.somethingto1 / about 3.25 turns lock-to-lock:
Think a lot of Buicks with V92 got this? Also, my Caddy Fleetwood livery package (R1P) had this.

17.1to1 or about 3.75 turns lock-to-lock:
think most 2.56 B-cars had this, maybe also L99 Caprices?

Don't know the option codes for those steering ratios? Probably indirectly referred to by suspension RPOs.

However, I do know that there were 2 options codes for steering assist:
N40 non-variable effort, all Caprices
NV7 variable effort, all Roadmasters, maybe some Fleetwoods?

Bet Bill Harper already covered this, hope it wasn't one of his pre-Aug '09 posts

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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-09-2017, 10:41 PM
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some reading on steering gears

I searched using my screen name and "steering gear ratio" and came up with 25 threads dating from Sep 2009

Here are a couple to run you down some rabbit holes:

https://www.impalassforum.com/vBullet...062-post3.html

https://www.impalassforum.com/vBullet...ers-2-5-a.html

Some thoughts on what the OP found--

"So jack the front crank the wheel to the right to get to the caliper bolts. Left side done. Crank the wheel the other way... what, huh... why was that less than 3 turns???"

1. with suspension not at normal ride height, the relationship between the mechanical stop on the knuckle and the stop on the lower control arm is not the same as with the wheels on the ground.

Re-check turns "stop-to-stop" with the car on the ground.

2. curious what wheel/tire you're using

3. are there marks on the front sway bar from tire contact?

As mentioned in the thread/posts linked above, the possible variations include (by suspension RPO):

(2) linear 12.7 with 2 possible pitman arms - FE3 & FE4 (and SEO 7B3 on 9C1)
(1) linear 12.7 with "short" pitman arm - FE1/FE2
(1) variable ratio standard effort - FE1/FE2 without NV7
(1) variable ratio with variable assist - FE1/FE2 with NV7

NOTE: N40 is basic GM language for hydraulic power steering, and NOT specifically assigned to the 12.7 ratio. NV7 was not used by Chevrolet, not sure about Oldsmobile.

Bill Harper
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Last edited by Navy Lifer; 07-09-2017 at 11:36 PM.
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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-09-2017, 11:32 PM
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I'm NOT saying 12.7 ratio was not used on FE1/FE2 cars. The higher-effort variants were typically used on FE3/FE4/7B3, as well as the longer pitman arm, which is NOT addressed in the steering gear info, other than as it relates to degrees of travel. Degrees of travel by application also depended on tire size. As discussed in one of the old threads, the 1/4" longer pitman arm translates to about 5% quicker movement of steering linkage for a given rate of wheel rotation.

Note the listings for late B-body, with gearbox "alpha" codes highlighted in RED - these codes are not in the parts book, only found on the gearbox "as built". Not sure if a build sheet may show gear code.

Sorry the data posted below is truncated--find the original info in the spread sheet mentioned below.

Technical Reference #14

look for this link to spread sheet:
1983-96Saginaw800FastRatioGears.xls

1983-96 SAGINAW 800 FAST RATIO (12.7:1) POWER STEERING GEARS
(Not including F-Car)


YEAR ALPHA CODE ORIGINAL APPLICATION GEAR RATIO EFFORT T-BAR SIZE TRAVEL

1983-84 Olds G YA Hurst 12.7:1 24-30 0.204 Dia 39deg 15min

1985 Chev G (MC) YA Monte Carlo SS 12.7:1 24-30 0.204 Dia 39deg 15min
Olds G " Hurst " " " "
Buick G " Sport Coupe FE3 Turbo " " " "

1986 Chev G (MC) YA Eurosport 12.7:1 24-30 0.204 Dia 39deg 15min
Olds G " V8 " " " "
Buick G " w/HO " " " "

1987 Chev G (MC) YA Monte Carlo SS 12.7:1 24-30 0.204 Dia 39deg 15min
Olds G " V8 " " " "
Buick G " w/HO " " " "

1988-89-90 Chev B WZ F41 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 43deg 30min
CP FE2 12.7:1 17-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

1991 Chev B
CP FE2 12.7:1 17-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

1992-93-94 Chev B
CP FE2 12.7:1 17-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min
FB Police 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 40deg 45min
HL Police 12.7:1 24-30 0.204 Dia 40deg 45min

1994 Buick B
KL FE-1 12.7:1 17-20 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

1995 Chev B
CT FE2 12.7:1 19-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min
DU Police w/FE3 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 40deg 45min

1995 Buick B
FK FE 12.7:1 17-20 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

1996 Chev B
TW FE2 12.7:1 19-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min
MX Police w/FE3 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 40deg 45min
KW FE 12.7:1 17-20 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

Bill Harper
ISSCA #127
[email protected]

Last edited by Navy Lifer; 07-09-2017 at 11:37 PM.
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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-09-2017, 11:54 PM
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96 Impala SS - see pg 31 of 58
https://www.gmheritagecenter.com/doc...let-Impala.pdf

92 Caprice - see pg 28 of 54
https://www.gmheritagecenter.com/doc...et-Caprice.pdf

This data solves nothing, but roughly correlates to the Shea/Team Chevelle info, and if you go to the GM Heritage Center, you can find a "vehicle info kit" for any year of Caprice or Impala pertinent to this discussion.

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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-20-2017, 08:03 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navy Lifer View Post

Some thoughts on what the OP found--

"So jack the front crank the wheel to the right to get to the caliper bolts. Left side done. Crank the wheel the other way... what, huh... why was that less than 3 turns???"

1. with suspension not at normal ride height, the relationship between the mechanical stop on the knuckle and the stop on the lower control arm is not the same as with the wheels on the ground.

Re-check turns "stop-to-stop" with the car on the ground.
You deduction was spot on Bill. Finally got around to driving the car yesterday (been having too much fun in the 08 crown vic pi lately)
On the ground it was indeed just over 3 1/4 turns. Always thought it was much like the 91 but never paid attention doing brakes and turning the wheels before. Guess I was just more sensitive to it as the box swap was the next step. I'm glad I didn't bring the SS box back to the other house. Now just for some free time again...

Yes, I've read your posts many times over the years. It's a nice grouping in this thread. What I don't recall was ever seeing the alpha codes. Is there an indication of those on the boxes?

Oh, the N40 in the FSM says 'constant ratio steering' On another site, N41 says variable ratio steering. And since
NV7 Steering, Power, Variable Effort was listed there too,
seemed the '40's' referred to just ratios and not efforts.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-21-2017, 10:46 AM
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1992-93-94 Chev B
CP FE2 12.7:1 17-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min
FB Police 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 40deg 45min
HL Police 12.7:1 24-30 0.204 Dia 40deg 45min

1994 Buick B
KL FE-1 12.7:1 17-20 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

1995 Chev B
CT FE2 12.7:1 19-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min
DU Police w/FE3 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 40deg 45min

1995 Buick B
FK FE 12.7:1 17-20 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

1996 Chev B
TW FE2 12.7:1 19-22 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min
MX Police w/FE3 12.7:1 20-26 0.195 Dia 40deg 45min
KW FE 12.7:1 17-20 0.185 Dia 43deg 30min

I'm remembering something else Bill Harper said long ago that the above options represent the same steering box, but 2 slightly different Pitman arms, & that the 9C1 got the slightly longer one

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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 07-21-2017, 01:46 PM
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Two Quotes from 95Wagon:

Originally posted by Rindy:
Can someone "please" tell me, Where does the alpha code appear on the box ?
Thanks again!!!!
Rindy


Quote:
It is an ink stamp on the the end cover or pitman cover. Usually long gone on any car that has seen weather or shampoo.
Quote:
One thing to look at, I have seen a couple of pitman arms that had one master wider and a corresponding extra wide slot on the sector.
One was an old 9C1, come tax,i so I have no idea what might have been changed but this pitman would not fit on a "normal" sector.
I can not find the information but I thought the 9C1 had a wide slot on the pitman arm so it would fit the shaft spline in two "clock" positions and this was needed because the longer arm
would have a "sweet spot" (centered) in one of the two positions. The arm being longer caused the problem.

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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 09-03-2017, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 91ss View Post
....N40 in the FSM says 'constant ratio steering' On another site, N41 says variable ratio steering. And since
NV7 Steering, Power, Variable Effort was listed there too,
seemed the '40's' referred to just ratios and not efforts.
I'm slow responding....sorry. The reality may be as you have revealed. All late Chevy B's may, in fact, be constant ratio, but it does not mean they're all 12.7 as far as speed/turn rate. The Shea info at Team Chevelle Tech only talks to the vehicles over the years that were 12.7. In other words, a 1994 L99 FE1 Caprice with skinny tires, 2.56 and no rear bar may have a 14.0 gearbox. I really haven't studied it that closely.

Bill Harper
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